| The Temptation of Saint Anthony |    |
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dOOm&gLOOm
Age : 22
Joined : 04 Jun 2007
Posts : 1477
 |  Subject: Re: The Temptation of Saint Anthony  Wed Jul 11, 2007 2:40 pm | |
| | Orion Crystal Ice wrote: | d&g has made nice posts.  |
Danke sir!
@ GW: I understand that you understand  If that makes sense. I wasn't trying to "explain" for all those who didn't "get it" ... just pointing out what I saw in the picture.
I also appreciate(irony?) your sentiment about art in general (music included) ... the one about the difference between "like" and "appreciate". I tend to "appreciate" almost all music if I view it as having integrity in the context that it came from ... and if it has its own message to send and voice to hear, even if I am not the one that is necesarily supposed to hear it.
That is all a wordy way of saying that I agree. I appreciate most of the music world. But I LIKE much less than that.
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GODSWIZARD
Play it LOUD!!
Age : 51
Joined : 06 Jan 2007
Posts : 11691
| | Subject: Re: The Temptation of Saint Anthony Wed Jul 11, 2007 2:42 pm | |
| It has been OCI, it has been. 
Like I said, I understand the symbolism in the work.
Blessing.......yes. 
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GODSWIZARD
Play it LOUD!!
Age : 51
Joined : 06 Jan 2007
Posts : 11691
| | Subject: Re: The Temptation of Saint Anthony Wed Jul 11, 2007 2:49 pm | |
| D & G said:
| Quote: | | I tend to "appreciate" almost all music if I view it as having integrity in the context that it came from ... and if it has its own message to send and voice to hear, even if I am not the one that is necesarily supposed to hear it |
Well stated. I agree. Those could be my words too.
I'll just add one more thing into the consideration. I appreciate greatly the physical and artistic skill and the beauty and skill needed to be a musician. The literal musicianship needed to do good at the craft of......um.......musicanship.
I can appreciate that skill and musicianship. I......just can't derive enjoyment from it. 
Hard/heavy/metal babeeeeee!!!!!! 
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"The 'farce' is strong with Obama-Wan." words of Scourge.
One of the twins: I'm the one who likes it all.... |
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RegnumIrae
Age : 22
Joined : 07 Apr 2007
Posts : 428
| | Subject: Re: The Temptation of Saint Anthony Wed Jul 11, 2007 3:06 pm | |
| Since D&G already made a useful post, here an unuseful one:
I love Dali('s works)! And this work is no exception! Awesome.. To speak with GW, I appreciate the skill and I derive enjoyment from it! Plus, between all of Dali's sexual.. tendencies.. it's nice to see a painting of his that actually conveys something more.. meaningful?
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dOOm&gLOOm
Age : 22
Joined : 04 Jun 2007
Posts : 1477
| | Subject: Re: The Temptation of Saint Anthony Wed Jul 11, 2007 3:09 pm | |
| I would like to ask GW what he sees in this picture. I'm sure he can give a better description of the symbols from a historical perspective.
You have said that you understand but you don't like it ... which leads me to believe that there's something about what you undestand that you don't like? (hope I'm making sense)
_________________
... a chill rises from the soil ...
... and contaminates the air ...
... suddenly ...
... life has new meaning ... |
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GODSWIZARD
Play it LOUD!!
Age : 51
Joined : 06 Jan 2007
Posts : 11691
| | Subject: Re: The Temptation of Saint Anthony Wed Jul 11, 2007 3:21 pm | |
| I have to go now. (Get ready to go to work)
But......i'll post in answer to your question, this week from work, one of the 3 nights.
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"The 'farce' is strong with Obama-Wan." words of Scourge.
One of the twins: I'm the one who likes it all.... |
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alldatndensum
Mission Of One
Age : 38
Joined : 03 Jan 2007
Posts : 5408
| | Subject: Re: The Temptation of Saint Anthony Thu Jul 12, 2007 8:37 am | |
| I'll tell you what I see, and it will demonstrate my total cluelessness when it comes to art. Here goes:
I see a naked man holding up a cross while staring at some really deformed elephants carrying naked chicks. The meaning? Dali liked naked people and deformed animals.
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dOOm&gLOOm
Age : 22
Joined : 04 Jun 2007
Posts : 1477
| | Subject: Re: The Temptation of Saint Anthony Thu Jul 12, 2007 8:43 am | |
| | alldatndensum wrote: | I'll tell you what I see, and it will demonstrate my total cluelessness when it comes to art. Here goes:
I
see a naked man holding up a cross while staring at some really
deformed elephants carrying naked chicks. The meaning? Dali liked naked
people and deformed animals. |
You are very perceptive! 
_________________
... a chill rises from the soil ...
... and contaminates the air ...
... suddenly ...
... life has new meaning ... |
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BackFromTheDawn
Age : 22
Joined : 18 May 2007
Posts : 3017
| | Subject: Re: The Temptation of Saint Anthony Thu Jul 12, 2007 12:42 pm | |
| i get what the painting is about...i just don't see every single symbolic element.
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candlemass
The Idiot Formerley Known As The Changeling
Age : 45
Joined : 08 Apr 2007
Posts : 1666
| | Subject: Re: The Temptation of Saint Anthony Thu Jul 12, 2007 8:23 pm | |
| | alldatndensum wrote: | I'll tell you what I see, and it will demonstrate my total cluelessness when it comes to art. Here goes:
I see a naked man holding up a cross while staring at some really deformed elephants carrying naked chicks. The meaning? Dali liked naked people and deformed animals. |
If you are clueless when it comes to art, how is it that you are making music? |
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GODSWIZARD
Play it LOUD!!
Age : 51
Joined : 06 Jan 2007
Posts : 11691
| | Subject: Re: The Temptation of Saint Anthony Thu Jul 12, 2007 9:15 pm | |
| Art as visual......
And....
Art as audio......
Can be two very different things; two very, very different animals.
Analogy:
I know a lot about history. Lots. I know more in a coma......than most people do fully functioning.
But....
I know an extremely large amount about the German Luftwaffe (Air Force) in World War II. So i'm likely to say a lot about it if asked.
However....
I know next to nothing about Dali, so when I do answer D & G's question above.......I probably won't say a lot.
In that same way......Alldat knows a lot about making art. It is just that his art is audio. Visual.......he does not have much to say.
_________________
"The 'farce' is strong with Obama-Wan." words of Scourge.
One of the twins: I'm the one who likes it all.... |
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BackFromTheDawn
Age : 22
Joined : 18 May 2007
Posts : 3017
| | Subject: Re: The Temptation of Saint Anthony Fri Jul 13, 2007 12:32 pm | |
| couldn't have said it better myself, GW.
good thing too, cause i wasn't planning on it 
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"He had discovered Time and Death and God"-Aldous Huxley |
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MetalH
Take me as I am
Age : 82
Joined : 28 Dec 2006
Posts : 4368
| | Subject: Re: The Temptation of Saint Anthony Fri Jul 13, 2007 12:35 pm | |
| I don't know much about art... But that picture is very insightful... Makes you think just by looking at it.
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endlessfuneral2003
Joined : 01 Jan 2007
Posts : 1140
| | Subject: Re: The Temptation of Saint Anthony Fri Jul 13, 2007 11:11 pm | |
| "I
see a naked man holding up a cross while staring at some really
deformed elephants carrying naked chicks. The meaning? Dali liked naked
people and deformed animals."
ROFL
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GODSWIZARD
Play it LOUD!!
Age : 51
Joined : 06 Jan 2007
Posts : 11691
| | Subject: Re: The Temptation of Saint Anthony Sat Jul 14, 2007 4:01 am | |
| O.K. D & G here is the response to your question below.
D & G said:
| Quote: | | You have said that you understand but you don't like it ... which leads me to believe that there's something about what you understand that you don't like? |
My responses.
I never said that I "...don't like...." the painting, or visual art in general. Look at my long post on the first page. When I say, I can like and enjoy none of them, i'm talking specifically about music and not visual art. Then that statement quoted above is followed by, I look at a lot of it. I appreciate very little of it, and those quotes need some clarification, it seems.
I don't really dislike visual art. Not at all. It does not bother me a bit. I.....just.....can't draw or gain or get appreciation from it. I guess......i'm neutral to it. I look at it. Period. It does nothing for or to me. No appreciation and no dislike.
Actually.......this picture is about as close as I get to *appreciating* visual art. Seriously. As a Christian the spiritual themes in this picture are mildly interesting.
D & G said:
| Quote: | The symbolism seems very specific as well. Near St. Anthony there are blatant symbols of death, discomfort, and pain ... and the further you move to the right side, the more you see symbols of subconscious desire, including the desire to reach the heavens. Then on the opposite side of the painting, you see the aforementioned phallic symbol, a symbol of fertility and lust ... which seems very deliberate and obvious, and, notice, is placed on the exact OPPOSITE corner of the painting from the symbols that signify death and pain.
Notice how the CROSS is the only thing between St. Anthony and the blatant symbols of lust, power, and greed.
I like how the movement of the image starts in the bottom right corner and moves to the top left ... directly through the middle of the two aforementioned opposing symbolic ends ... as if to suggest the presence of choice and temptation in the viewer's life as well.
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What you say above in that quote.......I see too. The man is tempted in both physical and mental ways. The horse at the front tempts him with the raw power and even the freedom it offers. The man is naked and armed only with a cross, symbolizing his GOD and his CHRIST and SAVIOUR. In his nakedness there is symbolically no weapon that he can employ in his defense. Only the cross, and that alone is his armor and defense.
Then D & G says this in a post:
[/quote] I'm sure he can give a better description of the symbols from a historical perspective[quote]
Actually no. I am not *cavalier* with knowledge at all. At university and in the history field i've been taught that if you know something--really know it--then speak up, and your opinion will carry some *weight* and be ignored at risk, by others. However, if you don't know it.......don't act like you do. Your opinion is appropriately *worthless* if you know not of what you speak. Or in other words.......shut the hell up if you don't know what you are talking about. That is a rule I live by. No, i've no historical perspective to add here.
I just don't appreciate visual art because.......I don't.
_________________
"The 'farce' is strong with Obama-Wan." words of Scourge.
One of the twins: I'm the one who likes it all.... |
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Angel with Attitude
The Emperor Has No Clothes
Joined : 09 Apr 2007
Posts : 2768
| | Subject: Re: The Temptation of Saint Anthony Sat Jul 14, 2007 11:23 am | |
| Guys: I think there is less to be frustrated about 'not getting' something, (visual art in this case) than people often put on themselves. 
Peope who don't 'get it' aren't doofuses, uncultured philistines, stupid, dense, etc.. 
We are all spoken to in different ways and for those to whom this image speaks, it speaks quite plainly (as far as content) The style is somewhat just beautiful and also somewhat upsetting, while also simply giving away the signature style of the artist.
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GODSWIZARD
Play it LOUD!!
Age : 51
Joined : 06 Jan 2007
Posts : 11691
| | Subject: Re: The Temptation of Saint Anthony Sat Jul 14, 2007 1:13 pm | |
| To respond to the three paragraphs/lines of your post above Angel, in order of your post:
A: Thank you.
B: Thank you......a lot. At times i've felt just like that. In my youth......I was bothered by the fact it (visual art) did not *move* me or make me *feel* anything emotionally, as it did other peeps. I felt just that......as you mention. Now--with age--i'm too old to care anymore. Just.....thanks, well said.
C: Well stated.
_________________
"The 'farce' is strong with Obama-Wan." words of Scourge.
One of the twins: I'm the one who likes it all.... |
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dOOm&gLOOm
Age : 22
Joined : 04 Jun 2007
Posts : 1477
| | Subject: Re: The Temptation of Saint Anthony Tue Jul 17, 2007 6:00 pm | |
| | GODSWIZARD wrote: | Actually no. I am not *cavalier* with knowledge at all. At university and in the history field i've been taught that if you know something--really know it--then speak up, and your opinion will carry some *weight* and be ignored at risk, by others. However, if you don't know it.......don't act like you do. Your opinion is appropriately *worthless* if you know not of what you speak. Or in other words.......shut the hell up if you don't know what you are talking about. That is a rule I live by. No, i've no historical perspective to add here.
I just don't appreciate visual art because.......I don't. |
This is not at all a bad thing. I wasn't trying to be or sound elite at all with my opinions.
Just your comment about 'understanding the symbolism' made me wonder if there was something you saw that you weren't saying ... something I didn't catch.
I know that good art (in any form) is *timeless* but I was just wondering if there was something about the historical context of Dali's world that would shed some light on this. That's all.
Good times.
Personally I have always enjoyed creating and viewing visual art. I look at it in the same way as I look at music-- If it's got something worthwhile to say, then I might as well listen. If it's just art for talent's sake (or music for talent's sake) ... then I respect it, but it is useless (to me).
_________________
... a chill rises from the soil ...
... and contaminates the air ...
... suddenly ...
... life has new meaning ... |
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Black Rider
Man in Morph
Age : 40
Joined : 08 Apr 2007
Posts : 8527
| | Subject: Re: The Temptation of Saint Anthony Tue Jul 17, 2007 6:42 pm | |
| | Do you think some people "see" things in art though just to pass themselves off as artsy. And I'm with GW. I can appreciate the talent but I am rarely moved by visual art to the degree music moves me. Especially something like the Mona Lisa. What is that all about, really? |
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Angel with Attitude
The Emperor Has No Clothes
Joined : 09 Apr 2007
Posts : 2768
| | Subject: Re: The Temptation of Saint Anthony Tue Jul 17, 2007 7:09 pm | |
| | Quote: | | Do you think some people "see" things in art though just to pass themselves off as artsy. |
Mm perhaps. Then again, I am 'artsy' but some styles of what is considered art not only do not show me anything at all but the comments of those who do see whatever in it often drive me up a wall. I still take that to mean, that particular style does not speak to me.
| Quote: | | I can appreciate the talent but I am rarely moved by visual art to the degree music moves me. Especially something like the Mona Lisa. What is that all about, really? |
Um, Dan Brown wrote this book thingy that has some ideas about that. 
Seriously, there are alot of theories as to what makes that particular painting awesome, none are the definitive answer IMO. Also, not being a fully acredited Art History professor, I have neither the authoritative sn00t nor the incentive of a paycheck to explain it to you at length, etomb. 
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only symbols can be twisted ,burned,spat on etc.NOTHING truly Holy can be desecrated.....
Courage in women is often mistaken for insanity |
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